Vaccination: To Titer or not to Titer?

[admin]

Hi Mary

Mable is a very healthy young lady then! That’s wonderful to hear that & I bet it’s a big relief for you. This is a very interesting subject well explained – thank you Patrice. I have seen some disturbing pictures of cats with horrible reactions to vaccinations (including tumours) & I think the titer testing is the best idea.

Sending lots of gentle rubs to happy, healthy Mable
Love, Sheena, Worzel & Ollie xxxxx

[admin]

Hello everyone

Miss Mable was vaccinated again yesterday. They were 2 months late , by design. I decided I’d delay them for a while but get them done in time that she wouldn’t need to have the full set again.

I didn’t do titres this year. I remembered that she was strongly positive for panleukopaenia (feline parvo), so asked the vet if she was being vaccinated against that (I think it’s every 3 years). ‘No, just leukaemia and flu’, said the vet. You’ll understand my surprise when I saw in her vaccination book that she was indeed vaccinated against panleukopaenia yesterday. I checked the vaccine label online. I’m a bit upset about it because I’m not sure I would have consented to it had I known.
We also had a ‘Wellpet’ blood screen (kidneys, liver, thyroid, glucose) and I asked for a PCV too. I think this was my mistake, using terms such as ‘PCV’ and ‘titres’. I (as always) mentioned my concern about vaccines and IMHA and Molly. It all seemed to fall on deaf ears and I felt she was quite dismissive of my concerns. Even asking for the vaccine to be given into the leg rather than the neck (which I always do, due to risk of fibrosarcoma in cats) seemed a huge surprise. My vets are usually very good but it is a big practice and we often see someone different. Sometimes we are lucky and see someone who knows our history and my paranoia, so I think we’ll try to see one of those in future. I will also be mentioning the additional vaccine. I don’t think it was an error, I think it was due, but I’d prefer to know what she is being given. Nor do I think the vet intentionally didn’t tell me, but I’m just not pleased about it.

I know this is all kind of non-IMHA and I hope it’s ok to post. Mable was very quiet last night, and it was a relief to find on looking here that she was quiet post-vaccination last year too. She seems better today, thankfully. This vaccination business is an annual worry that makes me feel sick. We’re going to try a new flea treatment too. She’s continued to lose her fur and get scaly skin with Stronghold, so I’ve ordered Advocate. No sign of fleas at the moment and I’ll be holding off until I feel she’s recovered from her vaccines. Thankfully the skin sores of the summer are long gone, but I’m anticipating it will return this summer. Her PCV last winter was 48%, the winter before it was 45%. I’m going to have to try not to panic if it is outside either of those.

Anyway, love, as always, from us.

Mary and Mable x

[admin]

Hi Mary,
you must be so frustrated with these vets that can not get your worries and fears! I am so glad that all the vets I am seeing now know our story and totally understand when I am obsessing about something. I think you should ask for the ones that know you and your story in the future. Of course they should tell you what your cat is immunized against and I would make sure there is a need for it.
Of course you can post anything related to cats or dogs here, that is my understanding anyway. And titers and vaccinations are pretty related to AIHA so you are fine either way:) Unfortunately I am of no help when it comes to cat immunizations but then I remembered that Dr. Dodds should have something and sure enough , here is what I found:
http://drjeandoddspethealthresource.tumblr.com/post/66885321280/dodds-cat-vaccination-protocol-2013-2014#.Vrq-ouZvA6E
Maybe you have already seen this? I am also no help when it comes to flea treatments, all the names you mention are new to me. Would fish oil and coconut oil maybe help with the flaky skin?
Best wishes,

Brigitte

[Sheena]

Hi Mary

It’s really annoying for you if people don’t know the history – even when they do, they still tell us the wrong thing! I don’t trust any vet except my specialist here or Dr Dodds, full stop. The number of times I have been told something incorrect is unbelieveable, plus I don’t think anyone will ever understand our complete paranoia because they have never experienced this disease.

Ollie has had some bad reactions to vaccinations in the past – huge swelling on his neck once – he couldn’t eat properly because he couldn’t bend his neck. Now, he has very few vaccinations – I use Dr Dodds protocol, as Brigitte says. We over-vaccinated in the past, for sure!

Both my boys were off-colour the day after some vaccinations – really lethargic & so on. I do think it’s normal after some vaccinations to be like that, as with people. Obviously Worzel has absolutely nothing now. I am completely convinced he is covered for life with most things anyway (apart from flea/tick diseases of course) so there is no need. Hence Ollie only gets a few now. I don’t blame you for being cautious – I am the same.

I can only say I use Frontline Combo flea & tick treatment monthly for my two – they have always had this since we moved here & neither have had a reaction to it, thank goodness. I would never use a systemic treatment such as Certifect or Nexgard (do you have those?) – too risky, even in a “normal” dog in my opinion.

I like Brigitte’s idea of the fish oil or coconut oil for Mable’s skin – I found this:
https://www.vetinfo.com/treating-cat-skin-coconut-oil.html

Both my boys get coconut oil as Dr Dodds recommended it for joint problems & older dog health in general.

After what we’ve been through, we will always be very cautious – this disease has changed me forever.

Love, your similarly paranoid friend, Sheena xxxxx

[admin]

Thank you Sheena and Brigitte. I am definitely going to look into the coconut or fish oil for her. She’s ok at the moment but it would be good to have something to use if the flea treatment affects her (we’re still holding off at the moment). Thank you also for Dr Dodds’ protocol which is very useful.

I took Mable back to the vet on Friday, despite a PCV of 42% earlier in the week. We weren’t able to see someone who knew us but we saw a new vet who was very nice. I burst into tears immediately and thought Mable had pale gums. The vet read Molly’s notes which meant I didn’t have to go back through it all. She tried to reassure me about how rare it is, and seemed to think that Mable is not at particular risk. Anyway, I asked her to show me how to properly check Mable’s gums, which she did and I feel a bit more confident with it now. Also, she suggested monitoring Mable’s weight as an overall indicator, and that if it drops without an apparent reason that is a good time to get her checked out, which I thought was quite sensible. It’s a conundrum really, because I know Mable hates going to the vet, I know it isn’t good for her to see me upset, and obviously it’s expensive (I also took her at Christmas for ‘pale gums’ which went bright pink the minute we got there). However, I will always remember how subtle Molly’s symptoms were and that it was my ‘paranoia’ which got her diagnosed. The vet’s point of view – which I understand – is that even if caught early, it’s not going to make a difference to the treatment. The difficulty for me is that I’m a terribly anxious person by nature and find it very difficult to cope with uncertainty. Anyway, this is a ramble! Sorry!

So, I think the lesson in all this, for me at least, is to consider titres every year (I felt much more confident with vaccination after having titres last year), and to make sure we see someone who suits our (my) needs! We didn’t have another PCV done, as the vet checked her over and didn’t see a need. Of course, I panicked it had dropped from 48 to 42% since last year, but then last year I panicked that 48% was too high and she might be polycythaemic. The vet said it was purely down to her hydration status, and I suspect she is right.

Much love as ever, from Mable, and her very paranoid owner!
xxx

[Sheena]

Hi again Mary

After what you went through with poor Molly, this doesn’t actually seem to me like you are over-paranoid – not in the least. Molly & Mable being sisters would make me think closely too. But of course this damn thing is so rare that it’s very, very unlikely – I’ve never read anything to say that blood relatives are at risk either.

I’m glad you saw someone else this time – she seems much more empathetic & kind & it’s so important we see a vet we can relate to – I pick who I want to see according to what the problem is – they all have their strengths & weaknesses.

I do agree about hydration – it really makes a difference to the PCV. I don’t know if you’ve read about TP – total protein – as an indicator of hydration? (I am putting a link to an explanation below in a separate post in case it messes the test up on here). Some vets tests don’t give a figure for it – I had to ask specifically for it at the local vets. Basically, dehydration = higher PCV & higher TP. Good or XS hydration = lower PCV & lower TP.

I remember once Worzel’s PCV was a staggeringly high 73!!!!!!!! That was after we had been lowering the azathioprine. I was also panicking he had polycythaemia too. But of course that’s only 5 above the high of normal for greyhounds. The re-test was 68 & he had obviously been a bit dehydradated the first time.

On the issue of catching things early – the earlier the better. You could avoid the need for blood transfusion apart from anything else. Like you, if I hadn’t insisted on a blood test after visiting the vet 20 bloomin’ times & getting nowehere, Worzel would have had delayed treatment & might have needed transfusion(s). He was borderline for a transfusion for a while as it was. I know some animals get ill very, very quickly, but some decline more slowly, so catching it as early as possible is of real benefit for them.

I think you need to explain to us all how to check cat’s gums – & how to avoid a visit to accident & emergency in the process!

Much love to you & Miss Mable from us all
Sheena & the boys xxxx

[Sheena]

Total protein in blood sample:
http://www.2ndchance.info/dxme-TotalProt.htm

[Vally]

Hi Mary, sorry I’ve been so slow.

I’m so sorry you were so upset at the vets. I feel like, at all times now, I’m ready to lose it at the littlest of things. Bingo has been off these last two weeks, not sure what happened, he was very weak and wobbly. Tests showed nothing. He’s slowly improving, but I’v been an absolute basket case.

This new vet does sound nice and I’m glad you can do the gum test. Does it work the same as dogs and only checking when they’re alert?

Brewers yeast made a big difference to Bingo and fleas. Since adding the brewer’s yeast to his diet, there are NO fleas on him at all. Throughout summer last year, I wold have combed maybe about 10 fleas off him a day (and it was a good year). This year, I have seen 1 flea this whole time. So something else to check. I understand it is okay for cats.

Love Vally & the one who will drive me totally insane.