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Jade, the cocker spaniel

Vally

Keymaster

Hi Angela, I beat Sheena to it and I’ve moved you to your own post, so I’m copying your post and Sheena’s here:

Our dog jade, an 11yr old cocker spaniel was diagnosed with Imha in October, 5 wks after receiving a immunization for parvo. Our vet was very quick to diagnose as her blood count was 14, and we were told her best chances at life were to take her to the veterinary college in Pei about 4hrs away.
We arrived there and jade was admitted to ICU where she spent 4 days, she became very sick. Developing an ulcer which resulted in vomited and diarrhea of blood. She received several blood transfusions. In this time they ruled out cancer with xrays and MRI. She was on too many meds to remember, most given through iv. After 4 days we decided to bring her home to live, or die.
Currently she has been doing well. She is on 75mg of cyclosprine and 15mg of prednisone daily. She also receives 8mg of aspirin in the morning and again at night to prevent blood clots. We also started making her own food. Jade is checked reqularly and her blood count is in the hugh 30s. However the past couple days I noticed a change in her appearance. Right sided paralysis, or signs of stroke. The vet isn’t for sure but feels that its vestibular disease and\or Horner’s syndrome. The next few days will be touch and go again as she’s feeling miserable. We could take her back to the university but the cost we have accumulated over the past several months is monumental.


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Vally

Keymaster

This is Sheena’s response – ignore the bit about moving you – you’re not being moved again.

Hi Angela & Jade

I will start a new topic for you tomorrow when I am more awake – I’m in France, so it’s late for me!

For tonight, doggy strokes are not like us humans get & most dogs make a complete recovery after a few weeks of what looks like a lot of distress – which is actually extreme dizziness.

One of my previous dogs had this & I thought it was really dreadful to watch -loss of balance, throwing up (I would throw up if I was that dizzy!) but 3 or 4 weeks later he was back to his old self. Most dogs get back to normal, but some are left with a slight head tilt, which is not a problem at all. One common symptom is rapid side to side eye movement, called nystagmus. It is disturbing to see. In my dog’s case it started the day after he collapsed, then he was sick everywhere & just kept falling over. Have you seen anything like thus with Jade?

Cocker Spaneiels have a predisposition to Horner’s Syndrome. One of our moderators, Linda, has a dog called Sadie, also a Cocker, who developed Horner’s. She is away at the moment, but I will tell her about you. Sadie is sometimes unable to close her eye properly & her mouth was a bit dribbly if I remember rightly – she will tell you more than I can.

Either way, neither of these things are anything to panic about as they are both treatable. Your local vet should be able to do this for you, but maybe need to work more on the diagnostics.

Hope this puts your mind at rest a little.
Best wishes
Sheena, Worzel & Ollie


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Vally

Keymaster

Angela, just wanted to add that this sounds like Horner’s Syndrome to me too. It’s exactly as Linda described her Sadie. As Sheena said, even if it is a stroke, it’s not the same as a people’s stroke.

I know she’s probably looking bad right now, but truly, as Sheena said, this is NOT something to panic about.

Linda will be in contact too. Hang in there.

Vally & Bingo

  • This reply was modified 10 years, 5 months ago by Vally.
  • This reply was modified 10 years, 5 months ago by Vally.


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Linda

Guest

Hi Angela! So sorry, was traveling and Internet and time was not my own. I am so very sorry that you are going through all this with your precious Jade. And sorry for this reason that you are here, but glad you found us. Welcome – let’s see if we an help and ease your poor spinning head a bit. This disease is crazy bad, but Jade can go into remission, as many pups do.

Yes, Sheena and Vally are right, Sadie has come down with Horner’s Syndrome at least three times. You can read her story under the drop down ‘Our Stories’ although I have not updated it (shame on me, I will do that very soon).

Sadie was ever officially diagnosed with Horner’s Syndrome until I did much research and presented the possibility to her vet. He then researched and agreed. So, if your vet picked up on the AIHA/IMHA and the Horner’s Syndrome, that’s really good. Usually, as in humans, a pup will develope symptoms on one side of the face or the other. Unfounately, Sadie’s started on one side, got better, then moved to the other side, got better and then reappeared on the original side again.

Sadie’s first Horner’s Syndrome symptoms were :

1. Dropping mouth. When she drank water, it would come out the side (still does, a bit), or when she ate, food would fall outrage side, not much again, but some.

2. She had problems blinking and closing her eye(s). Still does. When she sleeps, and this was really my first REAL clue, the second eyelid (pinky-red in color) will be seen, as the eye will not close completely. don’t panic, they are fine. It just looks very weird.

3. Her bottom lip and jowl sag a bit.

You are right, in that it is a kind of paralysis. It is the same with humans. Do they (dogs and humans) typically recover fine and if there is some residual paralysis, it is minamal.

To this day, Sadie’s right side of her mouth sags a bit and she can not close either eye completely. But she is fine and Jade will be too.

One of the best pieces of advice that I have revived regarding her eyes, is to use wetting drops for her eyes. While she was in Horner’s crisis, I used drops to each eye, daily, two to three times a day. That is so the eye does not dry out. I still do the drops once a day. I keep her out of the wind. I actually bought Sadie a pair of doggie sunglasses. Very cute, red sunglasses against her black fur. And the kids love the look too. She gets all kinds of attention in her get-up. 😉

We assumed it was the high prednisone, but as Sheena said, cocker spaniels are prone to Horner’s Syndrome, just as they unfortunately are to AIHA/IMHA.

We do not really know what brought on Sadie’s AIHA, but we think it was pesticides sprayed in our pond. She ran along the shore and unbeknown to me, they had just sprayed. Also, we had our house commercially sprayed a day earlier. Although they profess, safe, I have not sprayed since (four years ago!!) and have only seen two roaches, dead. What does that tell you? Safe, awe, I don’t think so. So, we think either pesticides could have done it, but who knows.

Sadie has had inset and three relapses. Just this last week we were headed for another, I think. But hopefully, we warded it off. We upped her thyroid med and tweaked a few other things. I hated leaving her, but she was with my trusted and dear greyhound friends. Back Kate last night and she looks good. In for a PCV check in a few minutes. Here’s hoping.

***** With Jade’s high meds, be sure he is on something for his tummy. Sucralfate is our choice here. Sadie was on it twice a day. It is a wonderful and very necessary help. Sucralfate requires a prescription from your vet.

***** Also, Jade will need something for liver protection. I use Denamarin (NutraMax), as many do here. I buy Sadie’s from Amazon, no prescription required.

***** Glad to hear Jade is in something for anti-clotting. Sadie was on human Plavix (generic, Clopidogrel).

Just so you have the THREE protections covered: anti-clotting, tummy and liver. 😊

Jade will become very hungry and thirsty – this is all very normal. It’s the drugs.

Have to run – will write again later. Keep us posted. Let’s get Jade well!

Love, Libda and Sadie


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Linda

Guest

PS – r cause typos – rushing (the usual!!!). 😜


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angela

Guest

Hi there, I made a mistake and posted a reply where I originaly posted


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Sheena

Guest

Angela – I’ve copied & pasted your post onto here:

Hi Sheena
Jade fell over yesterday afternoon and did a lot of shaking, and continues the shaking today. She is also doing alot of panting today. She vomited everything she ate yesterday and has no appetite today. I’m not sure if her lack of appetite has to do with feeling dizzy\sick or because her mouth on the right side has such a droop making it difficult to eat.
I’ve been more concerned with getting her meds into her. I don’t see a rapid eye movement but her head keeps turning to the right alot, after doing some reading she’s definitely got the signs of the vestibular disease.
All blood work came back yesterday looking good. Her red blood cells were up and her white cells were looking good. No signs of an underlying infection.
I am awaiting a call from our vet to see if there’s anything they can give her for the dizziness and nausea. Thanks so much for responding
Angela


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Sheena

Guest

Hi Angela

GREAT news on the blood test – number one priority is the AIHA/IMHA.

It does sound like vestibular symptoms, absolutely. Maybe she’s just been unlucky & got both at once which is so very unfair. I can only say again that both these things are beatable – it’s really time, anti-sickness meds &/or motion sickness drugs are given if needed with the peripheral vestibular issues (this is the most common type of doggy stroke). Same really with the Horners – more dealing with the symptoms of that as Linda so beautifully explained about.

The most important thing as that Jade is drinking plenty of fluids – she needs her water bowl really close (guaranteed to knock it over!!!) – if you think she’s getting dehydrated, she may need to be on a drip if you can’t get her to drink properly. That is vital, especially with being on all the drugs – don’t hesitate to get vet help with this.

My old Sprockett poo’d & peed on the flooor – he didn’t know where he was, bless him, so be prepared for that as well. He walked in circles & kept falling over. I had to feed him by hand because he couldn’t keep his head still enough to get it in the bowl. It was very distressing at the time, but I was really amazed at how quickly he recovered, even though he was quite an old fella at the time. The first two weeks were horrible, but we tried to keep him very quiet. Stairs were a nightmare – I carried him with a big towel under his chest/tummy, otherwise he couldn’t get around!

Good luck – have patience (yet again as you have to have with the AIHA drugs) & please, please let us know how Jade is doing. Hope she’ll show some improvement in a few days though on the dizzy front. I had labyrinthitis once & could hardly stand up – I felt really, really sick – it was truly horrible – I imagine Jade is feeling pretty rotten. I noticed a marked improvement as soon as Sprocket’s eye movements went back to normal.

Sheena x


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Reply To: Jade, the cocker spaniel
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Vally
Keymaster

Hi Angela, I beat Sheena to it and I’ve moved you to your own post, so I’m copying your post and Sheena’s here:

Our dog jade, an 11yr old cocker spaniel was diagnosed with Imha in October, 5 wks after receiving a immunization for parvo. Our vet was very quick to diagnose as her blood count was 14, and we were told her best chances at life were to take her to the veterinary college in Pei about 4hrs away.
We arrived there and jade was admitted to ICU where she spent 4 days, she became very sick. Developing an ulcer which resulted in vomited and diarrhea of blood. She received several blood transfusions. In this time they ruled out cancer with xrays and MRI. She was on too many meds to remember, most given through iv. After 4 days we decided to bring her home to live, or die.
Currently she has been doing well. She is on 75mg of cyclosprine and 15mg of prednisone daily. She also receives 8mg of aspirin in the morning and again at night to prevent blood clots. We also started making her own food. Jade is checked reqularly and her blood count is in the hugh 30s. However the past couple days I noticed a change in her appearance. Right sided paralysis, or signs of stroke. The vet isn’t for sure but feels that its vestibular disease and\or Horner’s syndrome. The next few days will be touch and go again as she’s feeling miserable. We could take her back to the university but the cost we have accumulated over the past several months is monumental.

Details
Vally
Keymaster

This is Sheena’s response – ignore the bit about moving you – you’re not being moved again.

Hi Angela & Jade

I will start a new topic for you tomorrow when I am more awake – I’m in France, so it’s late for me!

For tonight, doggy strokes are not like us humans get & most dogs make a complete recovery after a few weeks of what looks like a lot of distress – which is actually extreme dizziness.

One of my previous dogs had this & I thought it was really dreadful to watch -loss of balance, throwing up (I would throw up if I was that dizzy!) but 3 or 4 weeks later he was back to his old self. Most dogs get back to normal, but some are left with a slight head tilt, which is not a problem at all. One common symptom is rapid side to side eye movement, called nystagmus. It is disturbing to see. In my dog’s case it started the day after he collapsed, then he was sick everywhere & just kept falling over. Have you seen anything like thus with Jade?

Cocker Spaneiels have a predisposition to Horner’s Syndrome. One of our moderators, Linda, has a dog called Sadie, also a Cocker, who developed Horner’s. She is away at the moment, but I will tell her about you. Sadie is sometimes unable to close her eye properly & her mouth was a bit dribbly if I remember rightly – she will tell you more than I can.

Either way, neither of these things are anything to panic about as they are both treatable. Your local vet should be able to do this for you, but maybe need to work more on the diagnostics.

Hope this puts your mind at rest a little.
Best wishes
Sheena, Worzel & Ollie

Details
Vally
Keymaster

Angela, just wanted to add that this sounds like Horner’s Syndrome to me too. It’s exactly as Linda described her Sadie. As Sheena said, even if it is a stroke, it’s not the same as a people’s stroke.

I know she’s probably looking bad right now, but truly, as Sheena said, this is NOT something to panic about.

Linda will be in contact too. Hang in there.

Vally & Bingo

  • This reply was modified 10 years, 5 months ago by Vally.
  • This reply was modified 10 years, 5 months ago by Vally.
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Linda
Guest

Hi Angela! So sorry, was traveling and Internet and time was not my own. I am so very sorry that you are going through all this with your precious Jade. And sorry for this reason that you are here, but glad you found us. Welcome – let’s see if we an help and ease your poor spinning head a bit. This disease is crazy bad, but Jade can go into remission, as many pups do.

Yes, Sheena and Vally are right, Sadie has come down with Horner’s Syndrome at least three times. You can read her story under the drop down ‘Our Stories’ although I have not updated it (shame on me, I will do that very soon).

Sadie was ever officially diagnosed with Horner’s Syndrome until I did much research and presented the possibility to her vet. He then researched and agreed. So, if your vet picked up on the AIHA/IMHA and the Horner’s Syndrome, that’s really good. Usually, as in humans, a pup will develope symptoms on one side of the face or the other. Unfounately, Sadie’s started on one side, got better, then moved to the other side, got better and then reappeared on the original side again.

Sadie’s first Horner’s Syndrome symptoms were :

1. Dropping mouth. When she drank water, it would come out the side (still does, a bit), or when she ate, food would fall outrage side, not much again, but some.

2. She had problems blinking and closing her eye(s). Still does. When she sleeps, and this was really my first REAL clue, the second eyelid (pinky-red in color) will be seen, as the eye will not close completely. don’t panic, they are fine. It just looks very weird.

3. Her bottom lip and jowl sag a bit.

You are right, in that it is a kind of paralysis. It is the same with humans. Do they (dogs and humans) typically recover fine and if there is some residual paralysis, it is minamal.

To this day, Sadie’s right side of her mouth sags a bit and she can not close either eye completely. But she is fine and Jade will be too.

One of the best pieces of advice that I have revived regarding her eyes, is to use wetting drops for her eyes. While she was in Horner’s crisis, I used drops to each eye, daily, two to three times a day. That is so the eye does not dry out. I still do the drops once a day. I keep her out of the wind. I actually bought Sadie a pair of doggie sunglasses. Very cute, red sunglasses against her black fur. And the kids love the look too. She gets all kinds of attention in her get-up. 😉

We assumed it was the high prednisone, but as Sheena said, cocker spaniels are prone to Horner’s Syndrome, just as they unfortunately are to AIHA/IMHA.

We do not really know what brought on Sadie’s AIHA, but we think it was pesticides sprayed in our pond. She ran along the shore and unbeknown to me, they had just sprayed. Also, we had our house commercially sprayed a day earlier. Although they profess, safe, I have not sprayed since (four years ago!!) and have only seen two roaches, dead. What does that tell you? Safe, awe, I don’t think so. So, we think either pesticides could have done it, but who knows.

Sadie has had inset and three relapses. Just this last week we were headed for another, I think. But hopefully, we warded it off. We upped her thyroid med and tweaked a few other things. I hated leaving her, but she was with my trusted and dear greyhound friends. Back Kate last night and she looks good. In for a PCV check in a few minutes. Here’s hoping.

***** With Jade’s high meds, be sure he is on something for his tummy. Sucralfate is our choice here. Sadie was on it twice a day. It is a wonderful and very necessary help. Sucralfate requires a prescription from your vet.

***** Also, Jade will need something for liver protection. I use Denamarin (NutraMax), as many do here. I buy Sadie’s from Amazon, no prescription required.

***** Glad to hear Jade is in something for anti-clotting. Sadie was on human Plavix (generic, Clopidogrel).

Just so you have the THREE protections covered: anti-clotting, tummy and liver. 😊

Jade will become very hungry and thirsty – this is all very normal. It’s the drugs.

Have to run – will write again later. Keep us posted. Let’s get Jade well!

Love, Libda and Sadie

Details
Linda
Guest

PS – r cause typos – rushing (the usual!!!). 😜

Details
angela
Guest

Hi there, I made a mistake and posted a reply where I originaly posted

Details
Sheena
Guest

Angela – I’ve copied & pasted your post onto here:

Hi Sheena
Jade fell over yesterday afternoon and did a lot of shaking, and continues the shaking today. She is also doing alot of panting today. She vomited everything she ate yesterday and has no appetite today. I’m not sure if her lack of appetite has to do with feeling dizzy\sick or because her mouth on the right side has such a droop making it difficult to eat.
I’ve been more concerned with getting her meds into her. I don’t see a rapid eye movement but her head keeps turning to the right alot, after doing some reading she’s definitely got the signs of the vestibular disease.
All blood work came back yesterday looking good. Her red blood cells were up and her white cells were looking good. No signs of an underlying infection.
I am awaiting a call from our vet to see if there’s anything they can give her for the dizziness and nausea. Thanks so much for responding
Angela

Details
Sheena
Guest

Hi Angela

GREAT news on the blood test – number one priority is the AIHA/IMHA.

It does sound like vestibular symptoms, absolutely. Maybe she’s just been unlucky & got both at once which is so very unfair. I can only say again that both these things are beatable – it’s really time, anti-sickness meds &/or motion sickness drugs are given if needed with the peripheral vestibular issues (this is the most common type of doggy stroke). Same really with the Horners – more dealing with the symptoms of that as Linda so beautifully explained about.

The most important thing as that Jade is drinking plenty of fluids – she needs her water bowl really close (guaranteed to knock it over!!!) – if you think she’s getting dehydrated, she may need to be on a drip if you can’t get her to drink properly. That is vital, especially with being on all the drugs – don’t hesitate to get vet help with this.

My old Sprockett poo’d & peed on the flooor – he didn’t know where he was, bless him, so be prepared for that as well. He walked in circles & kept falling over. I had to feed him by hand because he couldn’t keep his head still enough to get it in the bowl. It was very distressing at the time, but I was really amazed at how quickly he recovered, even though he was quite an old fella at the time. The first two weeks were horrible, but we tried to keep him very quiet. Stairs were a nightmare – I carried him with a big towel under his chest/tummy, otherwise he couldn’t get around!

Good luck – have patience (yet again as you have to have with the AIHA drugs) & please, please let us know how Jade is doing. Hope she’ll show some improvement in a few days though on the dizzy front. I had labyrinthitis once & could hardly stand up – I felt really, really sick – it was truly horrible – I imagine Jade is feeling pretty rotten. I noticed a marked improvement as soon as Sprocket’s eye movements went back to normal.

Sheena x

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Reply To: Jade, the cocker spaniel
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